Final Fantasy XIII’s Simultaneous Engine Tuning
Final Fantasy XIII. A small title, perhaps you’ve heard of it? Kidding aside, this console-mover set to release in Winter of ’09 (in Japan anyway…) is deep into the development cycle. Yoshinori Kitase, the game’s producer, had a few things to say about the PlayStation 3 development cycle versus the 360.
Crystal Tools is the name of the game engine developed for this title. As far as the “basic engine,” Kitase stated that work on both the PlayStation 3 and 360 will be done concurrently. However, it is important to note that the plan is to finish the game on the PlayStation 3 version first, and then complete the porting process on the 360.
As you may or may not know, this game is being released exclusively on the PlayStation 3 in Japan and then on both systems in the rest of the world. Both Kitase and director Motomu Toriyama have made it very clear – the PlayStation 3 version will be done first!
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25 Responses to “Final Fantasy XIII’s Simultaneous Engine Tuning”
What I would like to see disclosed is, how will the port to the 360 differ from the PS3?
I know they say the PS3 version will be done first but are they taking advantage of the blu-ray for higher textures & uncompressed audio, just a few things they can take advantage of with the larger disc space.
How many discs will the 360 have? This is a clear indication of what kind of quality we can expect from this title, dvd’s are 9gb in size if i’m not mistaken? That is to say if they claim both are equal quality.
I’m sure the game will be beautiful and amazing, but I would like to know the differences are.
@nikrel
they recently said its not 1080p as well.. so what else are they leaving out?
@shadowjin
I’m not sure, is the Japan FF in 1080p or 720p?
I just found an article about JFFXIII
http://www.psu.com/Final-Fantasy-XIII-supports-1080p–a0007081-p0.php
the ps3 version is going to suffer big time, I’m sure of it because they are building it not to the true potential of a blu ray disc. All because they want to port it over to the xbox with as little discs as possible. I believe it’ll be 1 max 2 discs on the ps3 and a minimum 4 discs.
@Sneeches
That is what i’m afraid of, I do not think I will be buying this. I was so looking forward to this as well.
@nikrel
nope CG cut scenes are native 1080p, the actual game is 720p native but supports 1080p upscaling. which is dumb overall.. if the PS3 can do 1080p make it 1080p (i have the demo and switched the info setting on my HDTV). there to worried about people who don’t own a HDTV which is dumb especially when HDTV on June is going digital. all there promises of full 1080p is as credible as there “support towards the PS3″. I have a feeling there dumbing lots of things down to make it be similar towards the 360. regardless of what they said. there full of lies. the more articles i read on ff13 im losing faith that it will be using the PS3 potential. Its how they went on record to say that “they will support the PS3 but not fully support it”. when the truth is they have given NO support this gen. i think SquareEnix is under the impression that Sony should pay them to be exclusive, when Sony said no, they threw a fit and jumped ship. also when they stated that Sony needs to change there business practices. Whatever, coming from a company that has NEVER made a gaming system and all they produce are RPG YEARS APART. they have the nerve to say that.
@Shadowjin,
Then you’re probably familiar with this:
http://playstationlifestyle.net/2009/03/09/multiplatform-ffxiii-not-as-good-as-it-could-have-been/
Good Now I am feeling better about this plus the demo did look pretty effing sweet.
@nikrel and everyone else..
supporting 1080p (upscaling) is technically not by home theater standards TRUE 1080p. it just allows the image to go from 720p to 1080p by letting the TV upscale the picture. example: if you have a game that maxes out at 720p in a 1080p TV they can program it to not allow itself to be upscaled and it stays 720p in a 1080p HDTV.. if its not programmed in 1080p sometimes there are glitches in frame rate and breakage. Heres another example:
Burnout Paradise maxes out at 720p same as Soul Calibur 4. by un-checking the 720p on your PS3 you can force the image to be upscaled by the TV (if its 1080p TV). its no where near the same level of picture as a TRUE 1080p programmed game/picture and will suffer frame rate issues and sometimes look semi blurry. Burnout Paradise originally came out as 720p and later threw an update they programed it to do 1080i by freeing up space that was previously used(1080i made the picture sharper) it was the update that added in game music. 1 or 2 updates later they deprogrammed it to do 1080i reverting it back to 720p. If you force it to go to 1080i or 1080p it looks nothing like the original 1080i and FAR OFF 1080p.
@shadowjin
Yeah, I get the feeling about SE as well with the paid exclusive. I’m not very fond of SE anymore.
Never knew they told Sony to change their structure thats just insane.
Not interested yet.
@John Draisey
yeah i gotta re-read that again.. it just pisses me off looking at the 2 pictures i couldn’t read the article without going ballistic. Its not just about the cosmetic changes that the PS3 is having because the 360 port. its the fact the SquarEnix constantly assures people things will be all right. yet if you watch every article related to them theres a NEW CHANGE ie 1080p to 720p, visual changes, statements from there PR, upscale supporting… what the hell? Xbox360 is an up-scaler the chip inside is named Ana.. the Xbox can not support TRUE HD 1080p its an up-scaler.. last time MS was trying to say that the PS3 chip downscales…not true….if the programming is not a certain resolution it will default to its native in game programmed resolution. An up-scaler is no better that a 60$ 1080p DVD player that upscales the picture sold at Best Buy. while the PS3 can project the image at FULL 1080p. in simplified terms, a game has max resolution 720p the 360 forces out of its native resolution into 1080p, while the PS3 will not.. that isn’t a negative because it keeps the picture, frame rate etc the way it was programmed to run and looks better. the PS3 can do true 1080p when given the signal. Xbox advertises SF4 saying its 1080p when its bull because its upscaling the picture doesn’t look any better than 720 because its native resolution IS 720p, the upscaling doesn’t add anything.. yes ive seen both on the same TV. looking at a TRUE 1080p game/movie is like DVD and VHS. big difference.
@nikrel
this is what they stated about PS3 support : “‘We don’t want the PlayStation 3 to be the overwhelming loser, so we want to support them,’ he said. ‘But we don’t want them to be the overwhelming winner either, so we can’t support them too much.’ ………….?????????
Sasaki’s doesn’t take exactly take the humble approach regarding Square Enix’s heavy influence on the popularity of the PlayStation brand. The PS2-exclusive FFXII sold over 1.7 million units for a premium $80 equivalent price tag in the first four days after its Japan launch.”
he also accused Sony of having an identity crisis..coming from him who ALL WAYS hail the US as bringing new IDEAS to gaming industry. he needs to stop worrying about the US and focus on his duty as president of SE..heres the link:
http://www.geek.com/articles/games/square-enix-says-sony-needs-to-focus-ps3-marketing-20070910/
@Shadowjin Ok there’s some problems I want to comment about on this stuff.
First off 1080p gameplay is a much higher resolution than 720p
720p has a widescreen aspect ratio of 16:9, a vertical resolution of 720 pixels and a horizontal resolution of 1280 for a total of 921,600 pixels
1080p is a resolution of 1920×1080, or 2,073,600 pixels in total . Also a 16:9 aspect ratio
So when you do things like have anti-aliasing, and other things you do a lot of extra processing. Killzone 2 was NOT native 1080p. It was 720p with some special tricks they used to improve 1080i and thus 1080p.
Just because the standard is going digital in June means absolutely nothing. There are a LOT of SD t.v.s that support digital signal. They sell them at Wal-Mart… You can also get an adapter to get that signal. HD penetration rates aren’t very high. If you’ve played Crash Commando, or Disgaea 3 you know some of the problems with having games in HD. in fact one of the reasons I bought an HD t.v. was because on a small 19 inch t.v. I would get headaches from the flickering text and would have to look away much more often from the t.v.
Remember at least you’re not playing SD games anymore. No one seemed to complain that PS2 is SD. The Wii is SD. Halo 3 was even an SD game. Penetration isn’t that high yet in HD. It won’t be soon either.
Now going back to my earlier point. When your’e talking about 1080p resolution the problem is it has 2x as many pixels as the 720p resolution. Just like on a computer, if you have a midrange computer there will be some games you can have on 1080p resolution, some games you can’t have on 1080p resolution. It depends on the hardware as well as the programming. There is a chance that the PS3 can’t support 1080p gameplay. There is also a chance that 1080p gameplay would create a whole bunch of load times or frame rate drops.
In the PS4 I would expect to see the faster blu-ray drives, as well as more RAM, video RAM, and a higher 1080p set penetration worldwide (versus the low HD penetration rate we have)
At that point I would expect to see a lot more 1080p games. Whether the framrates would drop or the load times would appear (from what I hear there aren’t many load times in FFXIII based on the demo) the reason for not being 1080p is to increase the overall experience.
So sorry to all of you people with tons of money to have fancy 50 something inch 1080p sets (cause around 40 inches is when you see a decrease in quality from 720-1080) but this gen isn’t quite yours yet. If it bugs you that much please either wait till next gen, or sit a bit further back from the screen so that you can’t see the difference as much, and just enjoy the game as is.
I guarentee you this game would have been 720p with or without the 360 getting the game. Companies just aren’t willing to make that jump yet. This game is expensive enough without adding ot the expenses for a tiny Graphics Whore 1080p minority especially at the sacrifice of all the SD users.
@MakaiOokami
let me break this down..since your in another ballpark
im aware that 1080p is higher than 720p who doesn’t know that? test my already tested theory out.. get a 720 only game, than switch off 720p on your ps3 (having an 1080p tv). it never mimics a true 1080p signal even if you let the TV force 1080p.. my example are the diffrences in a TRUE 1080p chip like Sonys and an upscaler like 360′s Ana..next
switching to digital in SquarEnix’s eye is the reason they dropped it to 720p they have stated it many times that they want EVERYONE to experience FF13 and are under the assumption that most don’t have a HDTV. what i pointed out is that they don’t need to worry about everyone not enjoying there product because of the digital transition. reality fact 75-80% of the market is already in HD and soon EVERYONE will have an HDTV sooner or later. simply because buying a converter will not stop them from getting a cheap HDTV..next:
No ones complaining, there giving there opinion about quality being lost in the 360 port.. you should look at John Draisy link about an earlier article and correct everyone there to. all the tech specs you gave me are pretty much the basic of HDTV specs. throwing numbers out in the air doesn’t solidify your example, it just shows you know the measurement/amount of pixles.. next:
The PS3 can handle 1080p they have many games in 1080p..only recently a few have been using tricks ie wipeoutHD switches resolution to constantly maintain a smooth 1080p picture at high speeds that also includes no frame rate drops or issues. if i need to tell you 1080p games than your not looking at the back of the box..also killzone 2 is 1080i there was no trick to use 1080i and never used 1080p. that might be your TV up converting to 1080p…next:
i said in a prior playstation lifestyle article with 3d gaming that 1080p is only noticeable on 50+ inch Tvs..1080p TV sets are not expensive as before especially a 50inch LED,DLP,LCD only plasma ..they will always cost an arm and a leg because they are designed with gas as the pixel ie phosphors. You will see a difference in a under 50inch 1080p tv but wont get the FULL extent of detail as a 50… this is my side hobby and i am an audiofile..to feel sorry or anyone that bought a 40inch and under HDTV is rude. Computer monitors and HDTVs are simular but diffrent. the reason i dont go tech specs on here is because id loose everyone.. except probably some of the playstation lifestyle pppl
i hope this game is awesome and the playstation version gets some kind of exclusive content.
@MakaiOokami
if the original source is 720 and its forced to 1080p sometimes there are visual changes ie colors, sharpness, framerate..as for my burnout example..the reason EA dropped the 1080i was because there was frame rate issues when they upscaled it.. look at it from a logical perspective.. you have 720 lines max on the game..than force it to 1080p by unchecking 720 on your PS3 and only leaving 1080p. there will be a decrease in picture because its filling in the gaps ie resolution.. some TVs do a decent job others DONT. now take a 1080p game or movie on a 1080pTV huge difference…
@shadowjin that still doesn’t fix the problem that the PS3 would have to have a higher resolution overall which would probably effect the performance quality as this tech is probably not powerful enough to be able to handle anti-aliasing AND 1080p resolution. There’s only 256MB of VRAM and 256 MB of RAM.
Just like on a computer you can get a huge frame rate boost merely by dropping resolution from 1080 (sometimes more) down to 720. The reason why is half as many pixels, requires a lot less work therefore boosts performance.
Wipeout HD lowers the resolution during high octane racing parts in order to give you the great undipping frame rates.
Like I keep trying to get across there is probably no way to get the 1080p natively without sacrificing something else.
@shadowjin and makaiookami
since the game is being developed exclusively for the Ps3 in Japan, and since its coming out in U.S. first, don’t you think Square will take advantage of the Ps3 to make the game run, and look better. It seems like the idea to put it on 360 was a last minute dicision, and the 360 version should suffer for that reason and not be as complete a game as the Ps3 version
@MakaiOokami
the point is they have pulled it off before. i understand what your saying…also before adding the graphics chip they tryed and have run graphics rendering from the PS3 SPU’s. theres alot more to the system people think..wipeoutHD im aware thats there trick but they STILL run 1080p.
@Trexman
thats my point…various places have feared or come up with pictures that show degradation in the 360 and since SE is gun hoe about being visually equal theres always a chance.
@MakaiOokami
they stated that they wanted everyone to have access to the game hence why they drop the resolution..they never said they could not get 1080p.
@MakaiOokami
i do understand your statement about that theres a possibility they cant but until than its speculation because others have been able to.. ithink you and i ate up everyone else’s comments dude! haha
Haha way to go MakaiOokami and shadowjin!
Shadowjn gets the trophy for the most responses posted in one topic!
But this news comes as great relief. The PS3 version gets the first version, while the x360 gets the port! Suh-WEEEEEEEET!