Sony Confirms PSN Pass, Drives Knife Into Used Game Sales
After the logo for a “PSN Pass” was spotted on the Resistance 3 bundle advert in Europe, speculation grew rampant as to what exactly the pass gave access to. Sony have now confirmed the network pass, and detailed what it entails.
Don’t worry, it isn’t a Xbox Live-style attempt at forcing you to pay a subscription to play online, the PSN Pass will force gamers to pay a one off fee to go online with a second-hand title published by Sony.
Speaking to VG247, Sony said that the program will “accelerate its commitment to enhancing premium online services” for its first-party games, with SCEE continuing:
We are always evaluating new programs for our online offering, and starting with Resistance 3 this September, we will be instituting a network pass program for PS3 games with online capabilities
This program will be game-specific. Games that are a part of this program will include a single-use registration code that grants the account holder redeeming the code full online access for that title.
This is an important initiative as it allows us to accelerate our commitment to enhancing premium online services across our first party game portfolio.
So far, the pass has only been confirmed for Europe, with no mention of other regions, so we’ve contacted SCEA for a comment. Update: SCEA have confirmed to PSLS that it will also be coming to the US.
The aim of the pass is to monetize the used games market, which is hated by game publishers worldwide. With no mention of a price for the pass, how much would you be willing to pay for the ability to play online with a used game?
101 Responses to “Sony Confirms PSN Pass, Drives Knife Into Used Game Sales”
Am with them on this one, nice move on Sony.
I live with a big family. The problem I have with this is… Would my brother have to use my account to play online If I registered with my account. No more personal accounts within families. I hate this idea or registering for online play. I don’t want to end up buying a copy of the game and my brother also buying a copy of the game just to play separately.
Im also worried about that. Me and my wife play games online on separate accounts, im guessing that means she will have to buy a pass to play online? This really goes against why we got the PS3, free online gaming.
I downloaded my friends online pass for madden when I bought it from him, and it worked fine. So technically it would work, if you can get it from one account to the other. I can’t remember if that’s possible.
You know what, just forget everything I said past “it would work fine”. Words can’t describe how little thought I put into the rest of that.
I think its going to be like the EA pass where all you need to do is redeem the code on one account then it will make you download some extra game data that will grant an online pass to every account on the system.(because game data is through out the ps3 while saved data is not) That’s how I’m thinking it’s going to be.
i like this we’ll get a better service with out having to actually pay for it. that is if you buy your games new , which your not really supporting sony or the game developer or any console when your buying the game used. i’m not against people buying used games , but people should get something extra for buying the game new vs going out and buying it used, so whats wrong with that?
why are my posts being targeted with thumbs down? its sad to see people with no lives ruin the site.
Don’t mind this at all if it’s for online games they’re supporting with dedicated servers because I can see where the money spent for a pass would be applied for server up keep, kinda disappointed with MK9 getting this treatment and lacking dedicated servers because some matches can be quite laggy.
Does anyone know if R3 will be supported by dedicated servers? I believe insomniac used ‘em in 1&2 but I may be wrong, either way a solid game I have pre-ordered so this really doesn’t concern me I just hope this doesn’t turn into a trend where developers start doing this with games that run on p2p it’s simply not right imo.
Good, people who buy used are almost as bad as pirates. They don’t support the industry but give money to gamestop. I’d like to see a company give people who buy used games an hour to play singleplayer and if they want more they gotta pay $30 on the store, not only do you kill used game sales you also permanently end piracy. Plus it doesn’t affect the people who buy new like Capcoms DRM does.
Seriously? Buying used games is no where near piracy. I grew up poor so used games used to be my only way to even play games. Not everyone has the money to pay full price especially in this economy. Add to that the fact that the average person doesn’t know the difference when it comes to who makes money on a used game. I don’t get why publishers and developers don’t just pull the rug right out from under these other companies rather than beating around the bush. They could sell used games just as easily.
True. If they did a trade-in program to get credit toward a new game by trading an old one, like Mass Effect 2 for cred toward 3, they could sell ME 2 used and make more money off one copy. Its so brilliant, they wont do it.
How does a game developer just “start selling used games”?
First of all they would have to set up everything to be able to take in, test and catagorize those games. Then they would then have to set up at the very least an online store. But if they wanted to sell games to anybody besides hardcore fans they would need a physical store. And they would need it to be in a prime location, or pay a ton on advertising to be able to touch existing retailers.
Then they would shut everything down after a year because they lost hundreds of thousands of dollars, and no developer would do it ever again.
The tough economy is exactly why they should be harsher on used sales. Games cost millions now and almost every day we hear of a new studio being closed. Everybody wants to play the huge blockbusters but nobody wants to pay for them. Its either make shorter and simpler games to save money, go after used sales to get money or go bankrupt and have hundreds of developers lose their jobs. The right answer is obvious.
They already have online stores though, they just need to add a used section and a way to send in used games. Plus they could give a slightly better discount on new games then amazon cause it would be direct from them, a dollar less or something.
Besides, amazon doesnt have a store and they do just fine. So game companies dont need to open a store.
i went threw a time were i didn’t really have money to buy games , i just didn’t buy any games. its not easy when you keep seeing games u’d want to play but eventually i had the money to buy games whenever i wanted to. there are plenty of places that have sales on games though , best buy has games 20-30$ off , or other types of sales like buy 1 get 1 at 50% off or buy 2 get 1 free sales. the last time i went into the game stop around here , its pretty much 80% used games with small selections of new games. like i said , they aren’t saying stop buying games used , they are just saying you want to buy and play used games you’ll have to buy a pass to play games on our servers.
@Randal
Which developers have their own online stores? I know of EA, maybe Ubisoft?
Anyway, that helps my argument that much more. These companies are already halfway to being able to sell their own games viably, and STILL they decide that the online pass is the best option.
Sorry guys, what’s best for the consumer is not always whats best for the industry overall.
Okay, think of it this way then. What about rental games? A lot of people use gamefly. Who is going to pay a fee for a game that they have to send back? What if movies were like that and you had to pay a fee when you rented a movie or bought a used movie? Also, pretty much every publisher has a website where they can sell and buy back used games and for those who don’t it isn’t like they can’t make one. If people who make videos on youtube can make a living from selling items on a website that they made I’m pretty sure a games publisher could do the same thing. Say they bought back a game for 15 and sold it for 30. That would mean they are making 90 on one disc. I’m not saying I’m against this. I only buy old games that I never got to play used so it doesn’t affect me but I know it can be costly to buy new games for other people.
I don’t know about other developers, but EA has a one week trial for rental purposes. I’m guessing they think anymore time than that is worthy of paying the 10$. Consumers will decide for themselves.
Movies? When was the last time you played online multiplayer in a movie? That’s the point of the online pass, 10$ for a persons use of their servers. Again, up to the consumer to decide.
Ok, a bunch of publishers may take in used games but they clearly aren’t interested in doing it on a mass scale. I haven’t seen advertising for any without signing up for a newsletter.
“If people who make videos on youtube can make a living from selling items on a website that they made I’m pretty sure a games publisher could do the same thing.”
You don’t have to advertise on youtube because the internet does it for you. Sure, a publisher might be able to do the same thing, but are the costs worth it? They would have to spend a ton in advertising to draw people away from trading it at somewhere like gamestop.
And you have to think about selection. When I trade in at Gamestop I can choose any game from any system, even going towards peripherals. If companies took this route, you know they wouldn’t want you trading in their games to somebody else. Taking Randals example of Mass effect 2 for 3, that wouldn’t be worth it for anybody. If you trade it in early enough to get a good value you’re just sitting there waiting for 3. And if you trade it in after you’ve gotten a good use out of it, you won’t get much money and neither will they when everybody buys 3 instead.
This seems to be the most effective option, and if the consumer doesn’t overreact it could help with rising development costs.
@DarKnighT_0_9 , the passes ussally have a 5 day or so trial period for people that rent games , so they can try it out online if they want. if people want to have the right to buy a game used , why shouldn’t a developer have the right to put a online pass with there games? if you can’t afford to buy a game new , then how would you be able to buy a used game for 5$ -10$ less , then they shouldn’t be spending there money on games.
Developers and publishers have every right in the world for these passes. All I said was that I understand that some people can only afford used games when the price goes down and this could suck for those people.
@DarKnighT_0_9 , then thats fine , but there are places out there like a best buy that sells games cheaper new then game stop sells them used. they had la norie on sale for 45$ , idk how much it is used but it would be close.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olstemplatemapper.jsp?id=pcat17080&type=page&qp=q70726f63657373696e6774696d653a3e313930302d30312d3031~~cabcat0700000%23%230%23%2319r~~cabcat0703000%23%230%23%2321~~nf396||4f6e2053616c65&list=y&nrp=15&sc=gameToySP&sp=&usc=abcat0700000
fall out new vegas on sale for 9.99$ is one example.
@DarKnighT_0_9 , then thats fine , but there are places out there like a best buy that sells games cheaper new then game stop sells them used. they had la norie on sale for 45$ , idk how much it is used but it would be close.
fall out new vegas on sale for 9.99$ is one example, another is assians creed brotherhood is 29$.
@abercrombieco2 wow things have changed since I was young. I guess I didn’t realize that. Oh, and the only thing I buy from GameStop is PSN codes when Amazon is out so forgive some of the ignorant sounding comments.
@DarKnighT_0_9 , i remember when i was younger seeing phantasy star in a game store for 90$.
not mad at them if you really think about it these companies give us great online service that comes with the full game price and then gamestores give u chumpchange for your game then sell it 3times that and then a customer buys it and wants free online there money did not go for online like mine did…thats y i pay for plus so sony gets some $ to keep the network up to par and still give it free .more people should start protesting used game prices…..anyway thats my opinion
This is why i’ll support sony on the practice, they’ve been very good for years offering us 1st party games with dedicated servers and a premium online for the respective titles that have the support without asking for a cent where as M$ charges 60$ for a crappy p2p experience(except for gears 3 that FINALLY got dedicated after us fans pleaded for years to get them), with sony it’s serious they don’t blatantly shaft people, you know the money is actually spent going for enhancing your experience on their network.
I am glad Sony is doing this. These game devs don’t deserve to lose money to used game sales and pirating. Buy the game new and there will be no problem.
Stop being cheap.
Its not about buying used or being a pirate, its (for me) how i may have to buy a pass for my wife to play on her console EVEN THOUGH i get a game new. So no matter what, games may now cost me up to $70, depending on the pass price.
This is not ok with me.
With EA you can call them and they’ll give you another code, hopefully Sony will be like that too. But I agree, in your case, it is a bit of a pain.
Why are you getting mad? Nobody is holding a gun to your head to purchase a game or not. It’s your choice. Don’t want to pay for that pass? Play on one system, buy new, or don’t buy at all. For me, I have self control when it comes to gaming, so I can’t speak for everyone. But if one is that addicted that they feel they need to get mad, well, they still have a chance to get a life.
Not really a bit of a pain, like I said in my other comment you just need to download it for her as if it were DLC you wanted to share.
Im not “getting mad”, you said to just buy new and there wont be any problems. Well there is still a problem, games may be costing me $70 because even though i buy new i may still need to buy a pass. Its more concerning that Sony said “… in addition to online gaming, these basic services will be free of charge.” but are now doing a 180, online gaming is no longer free of charge.
Im not going to address the rest of your childish comment.
“that grants the account holder redeeming the code full online access for that title.”
It could be account specific like PS+, i hope its console wide but i think its going to be locked to the account its redeemed on. Each account on the PS3 may need its own code to play online, at least thats what im interpreting from this.
Randal, for your benefit read one of my comments about this lol.
If this pass works the same as EA’s pass, you don’t have anything to worry about.
““that grants the account holder redeeming the code full online access for that title.”
It could be account specific like PS+, i hope its console wide but i think its going to be locked to the account its redeemed on.”
That wording isn’t meant to be how it works in practice, just the general outcome.
You input the code as you would a 20$ card, or pre-order DLC code. You get the online pass to download, which is essentially DLC that says you can play online. Just like any other DLC, you could activate it on up to 5 consoles. So have an account on your wife’s console, and just install on her account. Sure it’s a bit of a hassle, but not more than buying another online pass.
Ill wait to see how it works, i just hope people who buy new games dont get screwed over in this.
Well I really highly Sony would make an already controversial feature even less consumer friendly but if you want to worry that badly, go for it.
This can only be good for Sony and therefore to us as consumers, because the 3rd party will feel more comfortable with Sony than with other companies, and that means more and better games for us!!!
Well I don’t need to worry about a wife playing games, cause I’d rather have her focus on everything but gaming lol…
The multiplayer for most games is just awfull though (Uncharted aside) I find either the gameplay is too mundane or I hate most people I play with (Seriously how can you get booted for team killing without killing anyone on your team?)
kind of a stupid move by sony if you ask me. doesnt really effect me i always buy new games i dont like buying used games everytime i buy used games they dont work and i have to take it back to gamestop.
if it does not affect you in any way, why do you think it’s a stupid move by sony?
This doesn’t really bother me that much. I only buy new games and I don’t play online. Maybe I can recoup some of my money by selling my unused online pass.
I wonder what people who buy games that are only single player new going to get? Just Saying this because I love Batman Arkham Asylum and am desperately waiting for Arkham City. Hopefully they include something like Nightwing for challenge maps
$10 – $15 would be alright by me & anyways it woudn’t affect me because I buy all my Sony 1st & 3rd party games new. I like to support them.
When you think about it I think the PS3 Pass will cover the whole system. So Say your wife plays the Resistance 3 and she used the PSN Pass. Her Husband won’t have to buy a code because the Pass is activated on that PS3. Someone Correct me if i’m wrong about it.
I don’t care for more than the same as Fallen mentions. It would be cool if the “psn pass” was connected to the PS3, and not the PSN. Not very logical, but it would be best.
I don’t see them doing it different than Qore, the PSP online entitlements or PSN+. It’s just not good business to block those of us with 2+ systems.
Ok people, it seems like a lot of you are misunderstanding what they are saying. I hope I can clarify it for you. If you think back to Mortal Kombat, they implemented the online pass. If you buy the games new, you get a code in the instruction manual to redeem the pass without paying anything extra. It’s badically Sony’s way of rewarding you for buying the game new instead of used. If you buy used games, you need to also buy the online pass to play online. They experimented with this concept with UFC, WWE, and Mortal Kombat. Now they are doing it to all games. Chances are, if you buy used games, the price for online passes will still be $10.
Alright another reason for me to eventually stop gaming, great.
When I thought Sony wouldn’t do anything stupid anymore I read articles like this and I shake my head. As I have stated before this online pass crap is completely ridiculous. Game companies are forcing people who buy used games to buy online passes just play online multiplayer and thats not right and it will never be right. If Sony is going as far as doing this they might as well start charging everyone to play online like Xbox Live. I’m starting to question why I bought a PS3 in the first place.
“If Sony is going as far as doing this they might as well start charging everyone to play online like Xbox Live.”
Haha sorry but this reminds me of those chain letters that go around every couple months about that. I mean, a one time fee of 10$ that you don’t even have to pay vs what 60$ a year? How can you even compare those with a straight face?
If its quality then the game would be rare to find used for a long while. I feel alot of games nowadays just add multiplayer because their single player is horrible anyway. I only support this like someone else said if its backed with a dedicated server but i dont buy used games anyways i only buy games that im really into and everthing else is basically gamefly material which i can care less if i play them or not.
For those who are complaining about the wife/girlfriend needing maybe needing a copy of the PSN Pass, just do what my girlfriend and I do.
She has her games and her PS3, as do I with mine.
So we’ll both grab a new copy of R3, prob from Amazon, and we’ll play together.
Buying new from Amazon not only gives the money the Devs deserve, but since Amazon is amazing we’ll most likely get $5-$10 credit for buying them, which will make our next purchases cost less.
You save so much more money buying new from Amazon than buying used at GameStop or whatever.
Really don’t see why people argue that they can’t afford new games, so they buy used.
Just shows me they have no idea how to buy something.
FUCK ALL THIS BS!!! I’m NOT paying FULL NORWEGIAN ASSHOLE prices for my games, so if i can’t get my games from a US or UK store online then I’m buying USED. I can understand ONE thing, GAMESTOP should not sell the used games, they should be on the private market, just like I can sell my old bike, NOTHIN wrong with that. If I can’t buy a used game then U shouldn’t be able to buy a used car!! I love to buy my gam,es new, but the NEW prices are sometimes RETARD HIGH! Here in Norway the price for a new Game is almost 100 USD I mean WTF!!! I’m NEVER paying that price EVER! So my question is this… IF I buy my game NEW from EBAY from a private seller… is that the same as buying it used?? I THINK NOT!!
Bro I know how you feel.
AAAAAAnd another thing… I WANT A DISC COPY OF EVERY GAME !!!! WITH manual NO STUPID PSN DL BS!!!! so if I want a Ps2, or Ps1 game, will the stores have em??? HMMM!MMMM!M!!!!!!!!!??????
I expected something like this from EA or Activision not Sony what a let down. I would like to point out that used games started off as new so saying that the game companies lose any money.is ridiculous. I guess in this harsh economic environment companies have to squeeze every last dollar from their fans. If it wasn’t for trade ins you wouldn’t be able to walk in my house it would be packed full of games. Here”s a better solution try making a product so good that nobody wants to trade it in. Although that is not reasonable it’s easier to do than stopping people from buying used. If Gamestop and other similar stores are hurting the bottom line that badly than undercut them and start your own trade in program. Charging your user base extra because they want to save a few bucks is discriminating against the economically challenged and unfair. Companies like Gamestop should have to pay extra for the right to sell used games not consumers only guilty of wanting to save like 20% of full price. Next up is trying to charge you for buying discounted new games. Then we’ll see if you all support these actions as much. I think not. I for one will not be buying Ressistance 3 because of this and will boycott any game that supports it even the great Uncharted 3 if that’s the case.
I think a boycott is harsh and you may also miss out on an exciting game because of politics.
Most used games range from what, $20.00-$45.00? I wouldn’t gripe if I bought a used game for $30.00 and had to pay $10-$15 for a PSN pass. Not too mention that most stores like Target, Wal-Mart, Amazon, and others have deals where you can buy a new copy for less than $60.00 anyways.
I agree with you on fact that it was already paid for, but I think that the PSN pass cost should be split between the used-game retailers and the purchaser of the used game. Gamestop and others have made a killing on small trade-in values, which they turn around and sell them with a +300% average markup. That money should be going towards further game development, or the devs period, but I despise Gamestop, so my opinion may also be skewed a bit.
My opinion is that the pass would be utterly ridiculous if we had to pay for our PSN access similar to CrapBox Live.
It’s the third in a series so all I’m really missing out on is more of the same. That being said I have an active boycott on Activision till they fire their CEO. I only broke it once on accident for Protoype at $19.99.. yeah big mistake traded it before I even finished it that’s rare for me. As for how much GameStop charges your way off its only100% unless you want cash. They usually end up giving you half what they charge in store credit. They don’t shaft you that badly. Still the only voice I have in Sony is my cash and if they PSN pass UC3 and they charge the $10 that EA charges then yes I will boycott it. And any other title they decide to tack it on to.
if it wasn’t for the consumer there wouldn’t even be a game business, and who does the companies care about, NO ONE BUT THEMSELVES, This whole GEN has been about MONEY even more than before, ever since the US began to smell money in the console gaming industry they have tried to buttfuck the consumers, and what are the consumers??? THE LIFE LINE OF THE INDUSTRY!!!! GEEZ!! now it’s like we should be thanful that they even bother to make games… SINCE WHEN the US mentality again. in japan it was about fun and gaming as an ART form, then the US comes and makes short easy games and sell em for the same price as a 40 hour + JRPG… RETARDED and now they don’t want us to buy the games used? they don’t care about ppl actually PLAYING and ENJOYING their games, just that they can get all the money they can from us
What about games like Madden… where their servers goes down 2 years after a title?
Buying used is what I do the most! All the games that I have bought used has worked for me. At least for GameStop you are able to buy a used game and in 7 days, if you don’t like it you can return it for full credit. Which many others and I take advantage of!. GameFly, Blockbuster or any rental place is okay, if you want to lose a stream of money… And with rentals you’ll have to pay to play online as well….
What should we do with our old/used games, trash/recycle them? Not to get compensated for products we want to sell back to the retailers. SONY might as well stop selling physical copies and only start selling digital only if they are so afraid of used games…
“You save so much more money buying new from Amazon than buying used at GameStop or whatever. Really don’t see why people argue that they can’t afford new games, so they buy used.
Just shows me they have no idea how to buy something.”
How do you save money for a new game that is worth $60 and not save money for buying a used game that is worth $40????? Really?
What I do is wait until GameStop is having a 50% trade in bonus sale and then I trade in a couple of my old games that I don’t want anymore. Add that with an extra 10% I get for being a PowerSaver member, I usually have $20 or more dollars off the price of a new game.
I do this every time I buy a new game. I get a new game. I save money. It’s win-win.
This is how I managed to get GT5 for free.
This is good business on Sony’s part. They’re just trying to look out for themselves.
How is it a win win your still out two or more games. While I love buying used games GameStop always shafts you on the trade ins. That”s why you have to wait for those specials. BTW those 50% deals are rare ones usually it’s 10% for 3, !3% for 4, 20% for 5 etc. So I always feel shafted when I trade for new but you gotta do what you gotta do. Best case scenario trade in for store credit on trade in deals. Spend that credit during buy two get one free used deals. That’s why I Love/Hate, Hate/Love GameStop.
I only trade in the games that I know I’ll never play again or I’ve platinumed and there’s no real replay value, like inFamous. Once you collect the blast shards, beat it good and bad, there’s no real reason to keep playing, you know. Games like that. So I never feel shafted. If anything, I feel pretty good that I’m getting rid of something I don’t really want and I’m getting something I do for cheap.
I like to have a revolving door of games. It helps to do it this way when you’re in a financial pinch. It’s always better to give up 2 or 3 games you’re not going to play for a cheaper new game, right?
I have to agree with this move from Sony. And as I read threw these these comments I’m seeing many comments where people didn’t fully think through their post. They just posted it disregarding the fact that it makes them look like a dumbass.
True. Or they thumb down a post. lol
@DMGilchrist Dumbass huh? “And as I read threw these these comments” check yourself before you wreck yourself.
@nuclearwarfare Thumbs down was for the twisted morals. Fine for you to trade in but bad to buy used? You can profit but not GemeStop? What exactly are they supposed to do with you trade ins?
I’m not sure I follow you, Cerebus. I have no problem buying used games, if that’s what you’re looking for. I was commenting to the people that were talking about saving money by buying used over new. Hell, I have used games. The last games I bought were used, but I’m talking about if you want that hot new release, you can get it by trading in old games at the right time and get that new one for pretty cheap.
@Cerberus That was a simple mistake, many of these comments have been consistently stupid.
free online gaming Sony used to say
this goes against the whole PS3 concept, and the pass for Resistance 3 will hurt its sales mark my words. I sell my games on amazon and buy other new games (i buy mostly new). If my income from selling used games is lower then my budget for buying new games is also lower
Publishers are shooting themselves on the foot with this online pass bs. Gamers dont like it. Offer bonus content on new copies, hey if i buy new and i want to trade with my neighbor the online pass is an issue.
Is my bad, i actually BELIEVED in Sony being with the gamers on this issue. what a huge letdown. milk the gamers all u want, it wont work
@rebelforce
I kind of agree with what youre saying about how this console gen has clearly been the worse as far as nickel and diming the consumer (useless dlc, withholding content from game in order to re-sell it to you as dlc, etc). And unfortunately, just like anything in the world, when something becomes very popular and mainstream, all the greedy bastards love to jump on the bandwagon and cash in. Those that WERE all about the gamers, are not so anymore. The influence of money tends to turn everything to shit. This is nothing more than another stepping stone to see how much they can get away with.
In a way I understand why Sony is doing this, but it seems a bit hipocritical since they advertised FREE online gaming since day 1. Now, technically online gaming would still be free (if you buy new,), but theyre playing this in a gray area, with limitations, by their rules.
Im really surpised by this move. I wonder if Sony would have done this if it hadnt been for EA starting this trend.
As far as the U.S. coming in and messing things up, I’d say that the business mindset is quite different than say, japan, but its not like the u.s. just got into this business. The Atari 2600 was released by an American company, Atari inc. in 1977.
Also, one thing you have to understand is that back then, there was no online play on any console, no servers to maintain, etc. The pretense for this fee is to “maintain” the servers. So its not like you need this pass if you just want to play the single player campaign.
Im not sure where I stand as of now. Ill pass more judgement when more details are announced.
Can’t believe I’m still so mad at this, if GameStop isn’t paying licensing fees or something why not attack them? Why attack the consumer? I mean you figure developers/publishers would have a huge class action lawsuit against GameStop and their ilk if that’s the case. As a national retail store consumers only rightfully expect GameStop(and others) to be paying those fees. To make your fanbase pay because your afraid of renegotiating license fees and so on is wrong. If they want more profit from the sale of used games they should charge those profiting off those sales. Not honest people trying to save an honest buck on entertainment. Lets not forget that they are reporting as a $74 billion dollar industry as of this year. So forgive me if I don’t BooHoo over their pitiful loses on some used game sales. Let them cry to the president they pay for in 2012 damn supreme court. I would rather be carded for video games then let those asshole have unlimited campaign contribution rights. Oops off topic sorry.
This topic is very controversial to say the least. You will always have people on a different side of the fence.
I think what bothers me the most is the obvious scheme to gain more revenue. It is a scheme and an inconvenience brought upon the consumer, Period. Not only that, but it automatically depreciates the value of something you paid full price for. How? Well if I decide to sell or trade it, the value of my copy would be less, since im selling/trading with a key and fundamental component of the game missing (online, since the purchaser would have to pay extra in order to access).
Also, whats stopping each and every single developer/publisher from jumping on the “hey, lets start charging for an online pass since everyone else is doing it, EVEN SONY!” bandwagon. Heck, I bet it was EA that influenced Sony. So whose to say Sony, a big player and a trend setter, wont influence others from doing the same? Now the mentality is going to be “if we dont follow, were leaving money on the table”, and if sony is justifiying these actions, others will use the same reasoning for justifying theirs.
I dont think people realise that this isnt just about an “online pass”, but rather a small and subtle shift in the industry to continue nickel and diming consumers, with a “justifiable” excuses or pretenses.
The same thing occured this generation with the out of control, and many times outrageous DLC. Sometimes its VERY OBVIOUS and APPARANT that content was purposely withheld from the game/disc in order to sell it later as DLC. Some companies selling DLC even BEFORE THE GAME LAUNCHING. People accepted it, bought into it, and even EMBRACED this concept. Now its considered normal for a game to have DLC. Im sure games are developed in parallel with DLC, and find ways to implement it as such when it could have been put into the actual retail copy.
Why bring up DlC? Just to show another subtle shift that occured in the industry, with every purpose and intent to nickel and dime consumers, that is somehow justifiable, and is now embraced and considered normal among gamers. This online pass I believe, is no different.
This generation a lot of good things have happened for gaming but also a lot of bad things. Having things that should be included as paid DLC, including things on the disc but having to pay an extra mandatory payment to access it (ex: MvC3), DLC that can/should be free unless proven with legit and true facts by the devs/publishers that the DLC they are trying to charge for has to be charged for and can´t be given to their consumers for free (ex: a new character in Mortal Kombat, LittleBigPlanet, a few maps in a shooter), paying to play online (ex: Xbox Live) and online pass.
DLC that can/should be free SHOULD be given to THEIR CONSUMERS for free, and there´re absolutely no excuses that can be said about this, look at how many games´ DLC, for example, Burnout Paradise.
Games should be developed like if DLC didn´t exist. Develop and add everything and if something wasn´t added because the devs didn´t have enough time, no sweat, just add it via a patch or FREE DLC. Not including things in a game or having things in a game locked and than releasing it as paid DLC is buying a game that is not 100% and than paying EXTRA/MORE for the complete game. So using the current prices, you´ll pay $60 for a game that isn´t 100% and than paying $20-30+ to have the game at 100%.
If any DLC CANNOT be free by any means, PROVE IT with real facts, than it´s fair that it´s paid DLC.
Paying to play online is ridiculous. It should be free and there is absolutely no excuse that can be said about it, both PSN and Steam are free to play online. Now if there are any features/online features that cannot be free by any means, than also prove it with real facts, than it´s fair to charge for it, and if you want that feature you would have to pay for it, it´s absolutely fair.
Online pass is also another horrible thing that has happened to gaming.
If devs/publishers want to keep people from buying used games than have reasons for people to want to buy the game new instead. DLC that can´t be free, for the people that buy the game new they get it free, people that buy the game new could also get DLC earlier, give points in multiplayer games to people that buy the game new, unlock things in multiplayer right from the start (ex: weapons, abilities), access to betas is really good, things like all that that are reasons for people to buy the game new instead of used but they can´t be things that should be in the game no matter what wether the game was bought new or used.
There isn´t any type of crap like this for anything else being bought or sold used, not even movies.
ALSO, if you want people to buy game new, make the game GOOD and charge less for games. It´s not just because of the crysis going on, but if there is a really good game that is out and the game is priced more attractive people will buy it new. People don´t want to wait until someone sells the game to play it, they will buy it new.
I have been gaming for almost twenty years and I will NEVER pay to play online and I will NEVER pay for DLC that should be free and I will NEVER buy games that are not released at 100%, but if I ever do I will buy it used because I won´t give the devs money for releasing a game that is not 100%.
Gamers should take action now and let the companies know, not pay to play online, not pay for DLC that should be free and not support games that fall under any of these categories and DEMAND that these things change! WE are the gamers, WE are the consumers and WE are the only ones that can change all the horrible things in gaming. If we don´t buy the crap devs will not be able to do it. Why do you think there´re all these horrible things in gaming like paid DLC that should be free? because we allowed it and we payed for it. We need to take action now before things get worse!
I wanted to add to I will NEVER buy games that are not released at 100% (which means things being in the game but having to pay extra to access it and things not in games that should be in it and than released for paid DLC) and that have online pass.
I find it ridiculous that i have to pay to play a game online. The games i consider to that rule is MMO’s cause with MMO’s your actually getting crap of feats etc to go with it, not just pay to play the game online. If Sony makes it where every game that has Mp a pay to play i guess ill just go to pc gaming. I don’t get what Sony is thinking on this they just had one of the biggest hacking/outage in gaming and electronics history and now they hit us consumers with this pay to play online. Guess Sony just sunk their battleship. What happen to PSN being free, its the reason why i canceled my xbl or only get once month sub ever so often cause i don’t think its right to make consumer pay more money just to play a game online. Making someone have to pay to play online just to earn a quick buck is low and stupid. If dev are so worried that their losing money on used games why not do what the movie industry did back than and still does charge the company who allows you to rent movies. If dev would say charge the companies like gamestop take percent out of their profits say 10% or 12% than they can make the money and everybody can be happy.
“Crap load”
Ya know what? Fuck this I’m tired of drama.
I buy my games new, mostly from Amazon, because I want the Devs to get my money.
I want to pay the people what they deserve for making my hobby.
They fucking deserve it.
That being said, I buy my games new, so guess what this PSN Pass does for me?
Absolutely nothing.
It costs me nothing extra nor does it hinder me at all.
I once hated this ideal, but the first time I was forced into this situation, got a game from a friend, I actually thought about it: Why am I bitching?
At the costs of used games I’m not even saving that much money compared to buying new on Amazon.
Buying new from Amazon I no longer have to worry about this shit, I don’t have to worry about the quality of the discs or lack of pamphlets, don’t have to drive and waste gas and I save money not only on the deals Amazon has but the added credits towards other purchases.
Honestly, if you only ever buy used games, I say fuck you.
The argument that there isn’t any extra people playing from buying used since the previous owner doesn’t have it is stupid.
Know what that means? The Devs get less of the money from the lack of new sales.
There is a constant amount of strain/players using servers without the additional income.
Think about it: 10 people buy the game, that’s 10 using servers.
If 2 of them get rid and 2 people buy those games used, it will still be 10 people using the servers even though it was 12 different people.
Now make that example much bigger.
When games start lacking proper dedicated servers, I feel the above example is a primary cause of that decision.
So the devs/pubs should get more money just because?
These little “project $10″ isn’t a way to cover dev costs but more of a way to take $ from Gamestop and other used resellers.
Let’s say I buy the game new and play it online for a full year. The dev gets whatever portion of my $60 to pay for their work + servers + bandwidth, etc. etc. Let’s call this value “x”.
Now let’s say there was no “online pass” and my friend bought new, played for a little bit then sold to ‘stop or on craigslist, whatever. Let’s say throughout the course of the same year, 4 people played the game and played online. The dev would still get “x” from the initial purchase + $0 for any additional purchase.
With the online pass, the dev now gets x + (4 * y) dollars where “y” is the amount of money the dev gets from the online pass purchase.
So even though the same game is played for the same amount of time on their servers, thus using up the same number of resources, etc. etc. the dev gets more money by having the online pass if the game is ever sold/resold on the used game market; that’s it and that’s all.
That´s 100% true and there´s nothing that can be said about it.
Just so you know out of the £40 made, a games developor makes around £3. They created the game. Suddenly the PSN PASS dosen’t seem like such a problem when you put that into perspective.
The companies doing this are just trying to milk that sale beyond the original payment, because we allow it. The companies are already paid for the game. Used game sales have nothing to do with the developer from that point on. We aren’t talking about filesharing here, the game was bought by one person, then it left that person’s possession and entered another. There is no duplicate, that single game is still a single game.
Ok let me re-educate you in the point of DLC. Downloadable Content was thought of YES thought of as a means of making more money pass the point of sale, the idea is to provide us with extra content that perhaps couldn’t be on the disc for whatever reasons for extra money, decided by the company. You keep saying this is made just to “Milk” the game for more money but it can’t be milking if the entire process and idea of DLC is to make more money.
It’d be like calling out airlines on using headphones within planes to make more money from you during the flight. YES, THAT’S HOW IT FRICKEN WORKS! DLC is designed to make more money after the sale.
What you are talking about is when a game is on the disc to begin with. That’s not DLC, that’s called an Unlock Key. So in short stop calling it DLCs, Unlock Keys are what your mad at, these are the things the add nothing to a game in the way of DLC except to unlock content already on the disc.
I Get Most Of My Games From Gamefly and i also buy some Games New From Gamestop that i want to keep. PSN Pass is only gonna cost like $5…. Gamestop wants you to trade in a $50 game for $15 and there gonna sell it for $40s and developers get no money for it…. Developers don’t get paid for that so someone who plays there game is basically getting it for free. Basically what Sony is a game your buying from Gamestop used for $40 you have to pay them $5-10 so your basically buying a new game…. but this is only for online play…. those of you who say well someone else bought the game so the developers already got there money…. yeah but not from you…. if i was to Make a video game like Uncharted 3 then sell it for $60s then someone use some of it then sells it to gamestop for $20 then gamestop sells it to someone for $50 who’s trying to save like 10 bucks…. and this process repeats and Gamestop is making Thousands of dollars off of this while Developers only made $60 off this game so only solution is to make people pay a some cash so the devs get money back so for every used game Gamestop sells The Devs will get atleast 5-10 dollar for it instead of gamestop making thousands dollars off of 1 60 dollar game and the devs get nothing
IDK why companies are being so anal with all this . If your game is being sold then what does that tell you ? really Sony nor EA should be doing this BS. If i have a game and its good im not selling it to gamestop to become a used game sell, but if the game is trash within a few weeks thats the devs problem and they should put out better quality shit instead of bitching cuz nowadays games lost there value with lazy devs trying to make a quick buck.
I Disagree There’s some games that are great games and when you beat them there’s just nothing else to do I usually only pay for Games like Red Dead Redemption, or Saints Row, Infamous 2 and etc now that Uncharted 3 has a great Multiplayer i’m buying that too… because after you beat the game you can still do something…. i usually only pay for open world games tho. I get all my games from gamefly…. and i also bought UFC used from Gamestop and i had no problem paying $5 to play online its only 5 bucks. I got LA Noire from gamefly it was a Great Game…. but the replay ability of it just wasn’t worth me to actually buy it bkuz i would have sold it. I think its a good idea to charge people who buy games used nothing to complain about your getting it cheap anyway and its not like there charging you $20 if you buy its used its probably gonna be $5-10s if you have a problem with it dont buy it used then. imo Good Idea
if you don’t think a game is good enoough why go out and buy it ? thats the problem people go out and spend there money with out really hearing about a game or if its not that great they ignore the reviews and buy it anyways , yes some games that score alright reviews are still enjoyable but unless i know im going to enjoy a game 100% from day 1 , i ussally wait for the game to drop in price , i thought silent hill homecoming looked alright but i didn’t want to spend 59$ on it , instead it went on sale at best buy for 29$ and i bought it then litterly a few months after it came out.
To the people who talk about wall mart, amazon, target and such. Let me tell you one thing, not all countries have thoose offers, and where i live the closest thing to really buy games used or new is a gamestop. There is rarely any offers that puts the price down on a game not untill it’s been a year anyway. And the price of games here is bull anyway, if i were to buy all the games i find interesting new i wouldn’t be able to afford rent, food, clothes and so on. Saying that buying used is just about the same as pirating the game is bull aswell, if i pirated a game i wouldn’t pay a cent for it. I blame the game market for having games be so expensive and forcing us to buy every game we want new because they put a tab on the online or just put most of the content up as dlc. I make up my own mind wheter to buy a game new or used. I’m just waiting fir the day where game developers puts a lock on the game itself, and if you buy it used you can’t play it. And yes at some point it will happen.
Why would you give someone an incentive NOT to buy your game.
If you buy the game you should be able to do what you want with it. If it has online capabilities you should be able to go online with it on any account you want to.
meh, it’s not like every game has multiplayer, and even some that do won’t have this online pass thing. If you want to save yourself a few $, buy new but a discounted/special price, and that’s it.
What would I pay?
In the immortal words of every delivery guy from romantic chick-flicks.
“Two Dolla!!!”
Frankly, the servers and networks that support online gaming are not a part of PSN. You do access them through PSN but they stand apart. They’re also cost money to keep running and maintain. Part of the cost of buying a new game is to support the infrastructure for online gaming. Companies get no money to support this system if people buy games used. So the idea of an online pass seems fair no matter who it comes from. We still don’t pay for PSN, we’re just being limited to paying a maintenance cost for whatever game we want to play online.
It probably does need mentioning that this might help control used game stores pricing. I’ve seen too many used games without manuals or some damaged cover selling for five dollars under the new price.
When a game is sold as used SOMEONE has bought it before, so the dev got their money out of it. It’s not like retailers got 30 copies of a game on launch day, opened them and sold them as used for pure profit. Going after the consumer is not the correct stance to take. Give us a better incentive to buy new, (Dead Space 2 and Alice: MR included a whole other game for free when bought new. More of that, less useless ******** like character skins) or better yet, quit shoving $60 pieces of **** out the door and expect us to buy it day one without some way to try them.
I don’t think EA and other companies are including extra games with their top sellers because they want you to buy it new. They’re doing it to boost sales, more than anything. And the practice of “adding an extra game” will never be commonplace because companies will lose too much money. If they did, we’d be paying more for new titles. Then everyone would bitch about that.
EA could have easily charged you $70 or $80 bucks for Dead Space 2 with that extra game, but they didn’t because it was a bargain, to boost sales.
If you’re worried about spending $60 on a terrible game, research it before you buy it. Don’t buy it because you have to have, then get screwed over by GameStop when you want to trade it in.
I think the point that people are missing is that this isn’t an attack on the consumer. Is the consumer effect? Yes, but it’s not like Sony is thinking, “Fuck everyone that buys our products, let’s try to piss them all off.” Sony is attacking the used game market (GameStop) to regain lost revenue.
No one is “paying for online play.” That’s the stupidest argument I’ve read in these comments because you have to buy an access pass for one game, but you can play Uncharted 2 or some other game you own online for free?
If this whole thing provides money that makes the PSN safer, better, more stable, and enjoyable, I’m all for it.
“I think the point that people are missing is that this isn’t an attack on the consumer. Is the consumer effect? Yes, but it’s not like Sony is thinking, “Fuck everyone that buys our products, let’s try to piss them all off.” Sony is attacking the used game market (GameStop) to regain lost revenue.”
If SONY is attacking the used game market, why charge the consumers and not the used game stores that sell them?
How could Sony do that? Once you buy a physical copy of a game, Sony loses all physical ownership rights to that game. It is our decision to trade in or resell that game to a place like GameStop. Sony can’t tell GameStop to start paying for the used games.
Instead, Sony is taking another route to basically undermine the amount of money they make from used games. It’s kind of like Sony saying, “If you’re going to sell our used games at high prices, then we’re going to put a cap on the online part of the game. Let’s see how many people are going to want to buy that game used from you when they can buy it new from us. And if they do decide to by it used from you and play it online, we’re going to get a chunk of that.”
Also, if you notice, a lot of the games that GameStop sells used are only a couple of bucks cheaper than the newer game. If I bought a used copy of Dead Space 2 after it was released, I’d pay $56.99 for it at GS. Why not just pay the extra three bucks for the newer DS2?
@nuc
Sony cant make GS pay them for used sales, thats probably true. I think what GS would have to do is re-structure and price accordingly any game that requires an online pass.
So for example, a used game a few months old might sell for $40, if that used game requires an online pass, GS should sell it for less to compensate the buyer. Lets say the buyer isnt aware of the online pass (which im sure many people wont be), if the buyer feels “ripped off” for just purchasing a game for $40, then realizing the need to pay an extra $10 for the pass, that buyer has 7 days to return the game right back. So unless GS wants to see a ton of returns, they need to do something about their prices to combat Sonys required pass.
I never said they did but not you or me know if they added extra games to make people prefer to buy the game new. But since you can only get those extra games buying the game new it gives consumers reason to want to buy the game new. It makes sense and I wouldn´t be surprised. I never said or thought adding an extra game will be a common place, I meant that giving consumers reasons to prefer to buy the game new is what devs/pubs should do and not useless skins. Companies wouldn´t lose money by adding an extra game, if a company adds an extra game it´s because they can add that extra game and still make profit. And no, we wouldn´t pay more because it´s obvious that the extra game is just an nice extra for people that buy the game new, they can´t raise the price.
If any company raises the prices of any game no one will buy them and the companies will lose. Unless proven otherwise $60 is too high and should be lowered. PC games are $50 so why are consoles games $60?
Not knowing wether a game is good or not and wanting to buy it used for that reason doesn´t have a stance in this discussion.
What Sony and other companies are doing is just trying to nickel and dime us. Read my previous comments so you know what I´m talking about.
The PSN Pass money doesn´t have anything with the quality of PSN, don´t let anyone fool you thinking it does.
Also, when someone buys a game used, no dev or pub is losing money or revenue because devs/pubs sell copies of a game not how many people play a game. If there are 50 copies of a game and all are bought that means the devs/pubs got the money and there are 50 people with the game, now if someone sells it, trade it in or trades with someone and someone else gets it, the original purchaser is just being replaced with someone else and it´s the same copy of the game. When someone buys a game used, the dev/pubs doesn´t have to give any money back. This online pass crap is devs/pubs is devs/pubs charging for each person that plays it.
which is a fuck you to consumers.
Companies should give us quality reasons to buy the game new and/or work something with GameStop.
“Instead, Sony is taking another route to basically undermine the amount of money they make from used games. It’s kind of like Sony saying, “If you’re going to sell our used games at high prices, then we’re going to put a cap on the online part of the game. Let’s see how many people are going to want to buy that game used from you when they can buy it new from us. And if they do decide to by it used from you and play it online, we’re going to get a chunk of that.””
That makes no sense. With what you say, Sony is charging THEIR CONSUMERS more because GS sales used games too high of a price? Makes no sense and if that´s the case that´s a BIG FUCK YOU to us. Online pass doesn´t give any dev/pubs any money we give to GS when we buy used games so the last part of you post is untrue.
Don’t you people know that used market exists for : cars, movies, music CDs, furniture, books …
none of these companies made any scheme to kill the used market (just think of how many people you know bought a used car and how many bought a new car, and we’re not talking about 60$)
EA or UBISOFT have $hitloads of money, they have absolutely no risk of going bankrupt, they don’t need the extra money AT ALL. If people buy things used, it’s simply they can’t afford new. What will happen with this online pass? no more people will buy games new, and poorer people will just buy less games. I’d say people will even buy less new games as this method is shocking, just showing the very rich once again mock the very poor.
If this becomes a habit, I can tell you that my habit of buying half games new and half games used will become 10% games new and 90% games used.